Transcript: 3 Yr. Plan Public Hearing - Cincinnati
Posted by: Alan R. Cochrun
Date Mailed: Thursday, June 18th 1998 12:30 PM
Date Mailed: Thursday, June 18th 1998 12:30 PM
PART: 3 of 4
REFERENCE: e9adba8c
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1 notice that you have lots of staff here.
2 MS. LAING: L I N, L A I N G. You
3 really caught me off guard.
4 MS. GOOD: I'm sorry.
5 MS. LAING: We do have several of
6 our staff members here. Certainly, for those of
7 you who do not know where we are we are located
8 right across the street. I'm sure that there are
9 several of my staff members here who would like to
10 make several comments regarding specific problems
11 that we have encountered and heard from our con
12 summers as we work with them. So I would invite
13 any of the staff members to comment. We talked
14 just this morning about some problems and certain
15 concerns that came up at our staff meeting.
16 MS. MARSHALL: Good afternoon. My
17 name is Muhyah Marshall. I'm with the Center for
18 Independent Living Operations. And what we were
19 discussing this morning is it would be really good
20 to maybe hear some input from anyone who has had
21 experiences with the new food stamp card that has
22 come out that I believe has been made mandatory in
23 the State of Ohio. And at meetings that we have at
24 our center called the brown-bag meeting where we
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1 have other agencies come together to discuss issues
2 about the usefulness of this food stamp machine for
3 people with disabilities.
4 Specifically, in this one case was a
5 consumer who is visually impaired. And how does
6 one use this keypad that has neither raised
7 letters, braille, or anything else. And for those
8 of you who don't even know what I'm referring to,
9 in the past, consumers that use food stamps had the
10 individual books like fake money. Anyway, they can
11 tear them off and use them.
12 MS. MENDRISKI: My personal card, I
13 got it last week. I'm sorry, my name is Judi
14 Mendriski. You have to actually swipe it through a
15 small keypad like an ATM.
16 MS. MARSHALL: But a keypad sits on
17 the counter of the store, you have to swipe this
18 card, put in your pass code and it will
19 automatically deduct whatever amount you are
20 spending. We already have problems with this just
21 because of the issue of --.
22 MS. MENDRISKI: I think it really
23 takes away a person's privacy.
24 MS. MARSHALL: If they have to have
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1 someone go to the store for them, they're giving
2 away their code to someone else. They have to
3 actually trust that this person who is going to the
4 store for them will not add onto their card. Now,
5 if that person is trusting that's one thing. But
6 then in terms of the disability issues, if a person
7 is visually impaired or if they have some other
8 way -- if they're unable to handle the card. We
9 were told also that if you put the numbers in more
10 than three times, after three times it will lock it
11 out, period. Three times will lock it out. If you
12 have problems, you are off the system. You have to
13 then redo the whole thing, from what I understand.
14 I'm not clear about that. But the difference here
15 is that me or you, many of you may have had that
16 problem with your ATM card, hit the wrong code you
17 do it over again, you're getting cash. This person
18 is trying to get food for the day or whatsoever,
19 They're trying to get food, and then to be locked
20 out.
21 So we have a lot of concerns about
22 that and we are looking at getting consumer input.
23 We've only heard right now about that one
24 particular incident, but we are concerned about
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1 this. It's a new system and we want to know what
2 we can do to help make some changes here.
3 MS. CORBETT: My name is Janet
4 Corbett. I shop in an electric cart that I use
5 from the grocery store and these things are mounted
6 on a pole and even when they dropped them down they
7 are not low enough for me to be able to reach and
8 see. So I have to drive the cart forward and get
9 out. And because of the limitations that I have
10 with my hands, I can get the card in, but I cannot
11 get the card out. And so I have to ask, you know,
12 for someone to help me with that, and I'm
13 embarrassed to say can you help me with this.
14 They didn't even think about the fact
15 that there was no braille on the keyboard. But
16 also know that even if a person who needs to use
17 braille was able to if it had braille on the
18 keyboard, I don't know how they would read what it
19 was or what was being inputted. There's no way for
20 that. This was not a well-thought-of system for
21 the consumers who are living with disabilities. My
22 ride is here, so I have to go. It's a transit
23 issue. Thank you very much.
24 MS. GOOD: You're welcome.
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1 MR. OSBURN: Thank you very much
2 because you answered a question that we brought up.
3 MS. CORBETT: It's the whole issue
4 of privacy and independence.
5 MS. MARSHALL: Because right there
6 you have to depend on someone else to either take
7 care of your card. You have to tell them your
8 code. And we were also told that the chip that's
9 on the card, if it is handled too many times, then
10 it's no longer useful. So if you're taking it out
11 of your wallet and you have to feel the card to
12 know which way to hold it you may inadvertently
13 destroy the card. And once again that person is
14 out of food stamps.
15 We would appreciate your comments,
16 but we want to get information. If you can pass
17 this out in the community, call The Center for
18 Independent Living Operations because we want to
19 get feedback on this so we can do something about
20 it.
21 MS. MENDRISKI: I just got my card a
22 couple weeks ago. I just wanted to let everybody
23 know about it.
24 MS. MARSHALL: Sure.
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1 MS. GOOD: Any other staff members?
2 Thank you.
3 MS. MENDRISKI: I'm Judi Mendriski.
4 This is the Ohio plastic card. I'll pass it
5 around. This chip, if you can see it -- I'll just
6 pass it around.
7 MS. HATCH: I'll do it for you.
8 MS. MENDRISKI: Anytime that chip is
9 broken, you've got to go back into welfare to get a
10 new card and a new number. If you do it three
11 times, and at the third time, it will totally lock
12 you out, totally. You've got to go back down to
13 welfare to put in a new number. Now, I haven't
14 dealt with this yet because I don't have to start
15 until May 1st.
16 But people around me said that it is
17 going to be feasible for me to put it in the
18 machine. I haven't dealt with it so I don't
19 know. There is a local group in my neighborhood
20 that is dealing with this. And if you want the
21 name of the group, I'll tell you later on. Thank
22 you.
23 MS. HOPKINS: My name is Susanne
24 S U S A N E, Hopkins, H O P K I N S. I'm the
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1 assistant coordinator for The Independent Living
2 Operations. And the center has encountered a lot
3 of issues or problems in regards to individuals
4 needing accessibility modifications done within
5 their home or to live independently. According to
6 the Fair Housing Act, the landlord can permit for
7 them to make the modifications; however, the
8 expense has to come out of their own pocket.
9 And a lot of times these expenses are
10 quite costly. And a person living on SSI or Social
11 Security cannot provide or afford these
12 accessibility issues. I don't know of any funding
13 availability or grants throughout that can provide
14 the funding assistance or financial assistance to
15 individuals to provide these accessibility
16 modifications within their home.
17 For instance, one of my consumers
18 with Door Tech is at a very low height in his wheel
19 chair and needs modifications in regards to
20 lowering the sickle which is causing the sink to be
21 lower and modified. Also there are ample issues
22 for a ramp to be put on the home, that is another
23 expensive modification to be done. And there are
24 no grant funding projects throughout as well.
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1 Sometimes the Medicaid disability we
2 have or a program will provide modifications;
3 however, if an individual is not eligible for the
4 Waiver program, then they cannot get access to that
5 service if they are not eligible, which leads me to
6 another issue. The enrollment for the medication
7 disability waiver. All waivers are closed for
8 enrollment until July 1st. This is causing an
9 agreement problem for individuals that are
10 basically at a standstill right now if they are not
11 eligible for the Ohio Rehabilitation Services
12 Personal Care Assistance program, which also has a
13 waiting list.
14 Then there's no programs out there
15 other than to access service through traditional
16 Medicaid. And you have to go through a lengthy
17 process or through a doctor's treatment plan of
18 care to obtain those services as well. And we
19 haven't had great success in doing that. So those
20 are things that I feel are needed for advocating
21 work to be done, and thank you for the
22 opportunity.
23 MS. GOOD: Thank you.
24 MR. OSBURN: Jon?
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1 MR. SAPUNAR: I'm concerned about
2 the sympathy around here. I'm John, J O N,
3 Sapunar, S A P U N A R. I work at The Center. I
4 coordinate family life, education, independent
5 living and peer counseling. And really, the woman
6 Janet Corbett, I thought she had a lot of great
7 points. I really want to see enforced some of
8 those things she talked about in the area of
9 benefits, work incentives, it is a very complicated
10 area. I'd like to see SILC and the COIA take very
11 active formation outreach to really let people know
12 what is possible. I don't know how many calls I
13 get from people on SSI who are afraid to go to work
14 because they feel they'll lose all their benefits.
15 Over and over again I get this. And as some of you
16 know and maybe some of you don't know, but as the
17 gradual decrease in your SSI -- the more money you
18 make, the less SSI you get, so it's not all of a
19 sudden, but people don't know this. I think Legal
20 Aid has a real model program here in Cincinnati.
21 They will do a complete evaluation consultation
22 with someone who is on SSI or is concerned about
23 how work will affect their benefits. They have to
24 go over everything. They do it in writing. They
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1 give a very clear definition.
2 I'd like to see the CILs all have
3 that component. I think benefit councilors that
4 can do that type of overall consultation evaluation
5 for people, it is important because it's a safer
6 area. People are afraid to go to Social Security.
7 People are afraid to go to BVR because they think
8 if they go there they'll lose their benefits. They
9 won't approach them in that way. I think CIL is a
10 neutral safe place for this to happen. A real
11 concern is the $500 gainful activity. This is
12 ridiculous.
13 MR. OSBURN: How long has this been
14 in existence?
15 MR. SAPUNAR: I think this is one of
16 the oldest in existence. I think in 30 or 40 years
17 this hasn't been changed. That if you make $500
18 you're off SSI. I'd like to see some efforts made
19 in that area. We are doing a lot in our center
20 educating people about the plan. I don't know how
21 many CILs are doing it. It's another power, it's
22 sort of a way of being able to take advantage of
23 some parts of the system. And I don't know how
24 many times I hear this, that you cannot keep
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1 someone. You get someone trained and then they
2 leave. The payment is too low to keep anybody of
3 quality or anybody to stay around.
4 I had a woman yesterday that called
5 me because of where she lives, she has not been
6 able to get any personal care assistance. She's
7 not near a bus line. She can move and that's
8 probably the best thing she can do. But she has
9 missed many opportunities to be able to start work
10 because she doesn't have a personal care assistant.
11 Then she cannot get any others. Then she was
12 taken off the role. If you don't use the program,
13 I think you're taken off for 60 days. And
14 basically, she's just in bed for weeks she said.
15 She stays in her bed. She's concerned about bed
16 sores. So that is clearly an area of something I
17 think had to be mentioned. I think it is very
18 important.
19 Another concern I have is with the
20 Bureau of Occasional Rehabilitation. I think the
21 centers -- I don't know how many centers are here.
22 I think SILC could help in this need to help
23 develop a clear advocacy support for people, NBAR.
24 What I find is people who are clear, assertive, and
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1 know what they want do very well in the system.
2 People who are not as clear, don't have good skills
3 around assertion and personal skills have a lot
4 more difficulty getting services for themselves.
5 And I think there could be some sort
6 of advocacy or working up a plan how people could
7 be able to access the Bureau of Vocational
8 Rehabilitation stronger. There may be some
9 difficult cognitive issues for traumatic brain
10 injuries. This is a harder disability to get
11 employment. So I think there's a concern about
12 people with profound disabilities and how much help
13 they can get. And if it gets kind of hard, how
14 much service they'll be able to get. My other
15 concern is -- and I've had this working in with
16 several people, vision impairment people who have
17 lost vision suddenly, they don't think they can do
18 anything again, and I heard this over and over.
19 They're not really given ideas about what possible
20 jobs are available. So I've heard this enough
21 times that I think that would be an important
22 service either for CILs to do that or help get that
23 happening through BVR and more consistently. That
24 would be really helpful because people feel
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1 terribly lost.
2 And when they go to BVR and they
3 don't know what to ask for, they don't know what
4 direction to move in. The other thing is ramps,
5 and Susanne mentioned accessibility. But I want to
6 say specifically about ramps, we are trying to do
7 something about this. But I don't know how many
8 people I've heard phone in and have been stuck in
9 their apartments. Maybe they had an accident and
10 then were in an apartment that they could use
11 before, but now, they return to the same apartment
12 and they cannot get out. They cannot get a ramp.
13 I had a woman who called in, she had been in her
14 apartment for months, in an apartment. She went
15 there because her ex-husband was going to help her
16 build a ramp, he didn't come through. She was in
17 there for months and couldn't get out. I had
18 another woman who was in a condominium and had just
19 two steps and couldn't get a ramp to get out. I
20 wonder how big this is in the state as a whole. I
21 don't know how much CIL's addressing this.
22 The other issues are there are some
23 services here, you can get a ramp if you live in a
24 home, but you cannot get one if you live in an
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1 apartment. This is one thing we are trying to
2 address because most of the people we work with
3 live in an apartment and don't have the money to
4 have a home of their own. So that's another area
5 that we are going to look at. And I'm wondering
6 about the whole state. Call the CIL, see what they
7 can do in that area. That's it. Thank you.
8 MR. OSBURN: Thank you.
9 MS. GOOD: Janus.
10 MR. JANUS: I'd like to make a
11 follow-up and comment to the last two speakers
12 concerning the ramps and transportation. And this
13 is around tax time. But some of these workshops
14 I've attended in the past, some of the speakers and
15 people exhibit they are in product line sales and
16 so forth. In talking about transportation, talking
17 about ramps, I would like to see the SILC advocate
18 my understanding under the current policy for the
19 IRS Department of the treasury. For example, out
20 of the goodness of my heart, if everyone in this
21 room required a room, whether you lived in a home,
22 an office, mobile home, or apartment, if you needed
23 a ramp and I could afford one for you right now,
24 because I am not the occupant, I do not qualify for
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1 a tax credit, break, or shelter, whatever you want
2 to call that, which I think is wrong.
3 Because I've had people approach me
4 and said they were interested in assisting as far
5 as the grants or some kind of modification to the
6 residential structure. But since they do not
7 occupy the structure, they do not qualify for it.
8 Seems like a technicality. So if you want to fix
9 up somebody's business, you don't get a IRS tax
10 break if you live in a home, apartment, mobile
11 home, any type of residence and you occupy it.
12 Then you make any type of improvement with ramp
13 access, any type of accessibility in and out as
14 long as you live there you qualify. If you don't
15 live there, you do not qualify. I would hope that
16 soon, for those of us that have that opportunity,
17 people wanting assistance that the owner of the
18 property would qualify for some type of tax credit
19 even though they don't reside in that area. Thank
20 you.
21 MS. GOOD: Anyone else? Do you want
22 to do questions and answers?
23 MR. OSBURN: I think we've had some
24 very good comments today. And exactly what we are
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1 looking for, we have about 45 minutes left. What
2 we'd like to do is -- well, first, let me say this:
3 While I'm thinking about it, another way to have
4 your comments heard is to put it in writing and
5 send it to us. And that will be incorporated into
6 all of the information that we are gathering and
7 establish some of those priorities. And right now
8 what we'd like to do is open up, I guess, the floor
9 for questions and answers for Linda or myself and
10 anyone associated with The Center For Independent
11 Living.
12 MS. HATCH: Do you have a question?
13 MR. OSBURN: Lin just made a point.
14 That plan is due by July 1st. So we do need your
15 comments really. I would say by June 15th, no
16 later than that if you do send them in writing.
17 MS. HATCH: I'm having technical
18 difficulties. Excuse me for a second.
19 MS. GOOD: Any comments?
20 MR. JANUS: Again, referring to my
21 comment earlier about governmental officials. I'm
22 just curious, and maybe for what it's worth in the
23 future or presentation or future hearings. I'd be
24 just curious what region of the state, with your
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1 past experience with other meetings, be at a state
2 capitol and geographic location -- I should be
3 happy when I come here, but I never see anybody
4 from the media, nothing in the paper as far as TV,
5 radio, print, and I'm just curious. Is think the
6 most Cincinnati typical of all other areas or do
7 you experience some or any media for any of your
8 geographic areas when you go to do simple functions
9 for hearings.
10 MR. OSBURN: I think the most press
11 release distributed to the media regarding the
12 meetings really from a TV station, I know probably
13 ten radio stations and no one's heard from them.
14 MS. HATCH: The difficulty is in
15 some ways -- unless you pay for a space the patrons
16 don't want to put it in, or at least we've tried to
17 publicize it. That's an excuse right now. We need
18 to do that anyway. Generally, they're in the legal
19 section, the legal notice. It's a very small ad.
20 But otherwise, we are trying really hard, that's my
21 job. So from now on we are going to try very hard
22 to make sure that that happens.
23 MR. OSBURN: And Kathleen, from a
